Episode #4
Musicals That Never Made It
With Hosts Gabe Gibbs and Josh Colyer
Note that transcripts are generated using speech recognition software and are checked by over-worked and under-paid interns. So, please excuse any inaccuracies. Thank you.
Original Release: Monday, September 07, 2020
00:00
Gabe Gibbs Our goal was basically like let's have Josh produce the best possible track that we can produce and then just tank it with the lyrics like..
Zack 00:05
That and so much more, coming right up on today's episode of the pod spotter.
MUSIC INTRO TO BREAK
Zack 00:37
We are here to fill the role of looking for great content for you. We are your podcast pro curator. If you like this show, please check us out and visit us at thepodspotter.com and on Facebook and Twitter and Instagram @thepod spotter for lots of good stuff and please, please leave a review a good one bad one doesn’t matter all press is good press subscribe rate review, judge us on Apple podcasts, help spread the word. We release every Monday with a great new review of a new pod and we’re just gonna keep plowing ahead whether you like it or not. So please keep listening. And if you have suggestions for pods that you think we should feature drop us a note on any of our social media platforms or at thepodspotter.com. Thanks everybody.
Zack 01:33
MUSIC OUT OF BREAK
Pod people - Broadway is shut down till 2021 but we here at The Pod Spotter have identified a pod where you can go right now and here six fully produced Broadway caliber shows. However, these are the unsung productions, the might have been, the almost made its. Two self-proclaimed buffoons have written musicals that are, shall we say, not good, but blinded by their own arrogance and I have convinced some of Broadway’s finest stars to appear in the brand new podcast Musicals That Never Made It. Our guests today are actor comedian Gabe Gibbs, alongside his writing partner and musical producer Josh Collier. Welcome, gentlemen. How are you? Thank you for being here.
Gabe Gibbs 02:29
Hello. Thank you. We are well thanks for having us.
Zack 02:33
Well, we’ve really enjoyed the pot here. We have been screening hundreds and a lot of what we hear is, you know, two friends, just yammering on in a microphone and cracking jokes and not that there isn't value in that you'll get shorter content there. But when you come across one like yours that clearly put so much effort and work into producing what amounts to a basically a full, you know, Broadway show. It stands to be recognized, and we want to share it with people and I think that more people should be listening to your pod, because it's darn good. And I just want to kick things off with so people know what we're talking about a song that kind of grabbed my attention early and will grab listeners early when they hear it and probably because it sounds fairly similar to other stuff that might be out there in the in the Zeitgeist. Let's listen to quickly a song from a loop de loop melody.
Cut to Excerpt:
03:29
I love you darling. But do you think you can design a ride better than Mr. Ferris?
I know I came on to your wife and now respect your concerns. But a ride should be just like life it should have twists and turns to mimic life flying by it should gain forward ground to mimic when you ask why you should go upside down.
Upside down?
Yeah, that's right.
That's why you're up late each night, you've been gone every eve!
For the best you must believe, I'm at the shop at my desk. Angling lines with my protractor. But to be the very best a loop de loop is what I'm after.
Around and around, practically still, I want off this ferris wheel. I want to go upside down and up a hill. I want more than actual thrill.
BACK TO INTERVIEW
Zack 04:29
Beautiful! Inspired, maybe inspired maybe by musicals out there. But these are all the original shows. Guys, please describe your podcast as though you were describing it to your aunt at a family gathering who has never heard it before and maybe doesn't even know what a podcast is.
Gabe Gibbs 04:47
Right? Oh gosh. Yeah, it's if she doesn't know what a podcast is. It's a digital radio where I guess you could say Josh and I have created sort of alternate personas of ourselves that our musical composers just, you know, aching to be heard in the, in the sphere of other musical composers. But we, we have written essentially terrible musicals, but we force Broadway stars for one reason or another, to, to star in these musicals that are of course, listenable, like we couldn't write, like, music that you can't listen to, or, like, unsatisfying to the ear, but like, the premises are terrible. And it sort of kind of feels like when you go to see, you know, those, those children's recitals that you go to see that are underwhelming, in a nice way. Those people don't stop making things. And so we sort of felt like, like we were those boys that grew up, and no one ever said, hey, maybe don't, you know?
Josh Colyer 06:05
Yeah, we just kept getting encouragement and affirmation from people to keep going.
Gabe Gibbs 06:09
Mostly from ourselves.
Zack 06:12
Yeah, they're big shows. They're big themes. They are big ideas, but they're all centered around these very seemingly simple and everyday mundane thing. Big musicals about silly little things.
Josh Colyer 06:25
Right. There's, there was a bit of a balance we had to find to where you could totally see these two guys thinking that this is a great idea.
Zack 06:35
Gabe and Collier, by the way that I mean, you guys, that's the name of you know, that sounds like Sondheim. Did you workshop Colyer and Gibbs. For like, no, no...
Gabe Gibbs 06:48
Well, yeah. Yeah. That's funny. It does go. It could go both ways. But the but usually the Colyer does have a nicer ending to it.
Gabe Gibbs 07:03
Yeah, that's true. That's true. Josh. It does feel like being a guy. I'm an actor boy who's done a lot of these like workshops of bad musicals. And every time you're in a bad one, you're like, oh, I see how you could think that this is great. Like, you could convince yourself this is great. And so we tried to tap into like, yeah, you know, these boys could possibly believe that maybe it’s a really good idea.
Zack 07:31
When you are in those rooms, and you're workshopping new material. Is there a moment where you, you're like, hh, this is a this is a musical that's never gonna make it. Because everyone comes with the best intentions, everyone's talented, you show up. People have obviously put in years of thought. It takes a tremendous amount just to get it to that stage. But, go ahead.
Gabe Gibbs 07:56
I would say I would say just personal experience. There is this there is this thing that like, the obviously the creator never has any clue, because otherwise the writer of the musical never knows. And I won't name any names at all, of course, but there is moment, I have found where it's the first day of rehearsal or, or the second day of rehearsal when a couple of the actors who didn't know each other before, decide to like, “Hey, man, you want to get coffee before this or get coffee after this” and then there's like, a split second where you're all chit chatting, and you're kind of dancing around it, seeing if like, this person's maybe having more fun than I am at this. Yeah. And then there's that moment of like - this show. It's, it's fun. Yeah. That's kind of how you got to start is like - it's a fun one, huh?
Zack 08:57
Just gauging. So that the transcript of the conversation reads straight up – this is fine. It's all just telepathy. We are in something weird, right? Yes, yes. And so this podcast becomes a celebration of those weird productions that are carried through to fruition maybe a little longer than they should but when - I gotta tell you like listening to it, you're like, because of how, because of the conceit and because how you set us up for them to be bad musicals it is such a surprise when like, I'm jamming to these songs, and they're good, like, they're actually good. And I don't know, like, is that is deliberate? Is that a tactic to just sort of undersell what you're doing? And then yeah, no, here's some beautiful songs. Actually.
Josh Colyer 09:41
It was clear that the production and the actual sound and flow of the song would be, would be good enough for people to continue to listen to and to and to engage with. The thing that derails it is the idea for the song and the lyrics, but everything else like we wanted the beat to be like just knocking, we wanted it to be an actual, like great production, which is like, I spent a lot of time just trying to make it as good as I could. But what makes it go down real quick is when like the verse comes in, and then you realize it's just really bad lyrics. And no one should be writing a song because of this reason.
Zack 10:18
Can you talk about that time, the time that goes into it? Because from sort of soup to nuts, they're from like, here's the song. It's about rollercoasters. And just producing one episode. I know how much goes into - I'm just talking to people and there's a ton of work that goes into this, but I can't imagine, if you want to just discuss quickly.
Josh Colyer 10:37
Yeah, writing it, it was just me and him, me and Gabe sending voice memos to each other, and just trying to create a song that way back and forth. And he'd send me something. And then I would just put it into my, my recording software and try and create a feel out of what he's…
Zack 10:55
What does that say? Is that just audio? That's just him? Like a melody?
Gabe Gibbs 10:59
Yeah, so I would send him like, my version of the story is that I send Josh like, terrible bones of a song. And then he goes, “You mean like this?”. And it's like, way better than what I would have intended. Of course, you know, Josh and I are always underselling but it, we, we sort of identify, like, we take the crap idea or the title of the show. And then, you know, in musical theater structure, you have like, typical song moments that service story beats and we like to like find, like, oh, it would be so funny. Like in musical theater, there's, there's the I want song, which is like, you know, usually beginning of Act One, it's, it's the main character laying out their sort of arc. So you have like that kind of a, that exists in every musical. And then usually, your end of Act One is like, all the characters coming back together and, like all your characters coming back together and sort of declaring, like, you know, this is where we're at, and “bla bla bla bla bla” here comes intermission. Then you've got you know, all these different beats so we take our terrible idea. And we look at like, oh, what would be the crappiest “I want song” we could write or what would be like, the worst, like 11 o'clock number where the character finally figures out what they really needed all along kind of stuff. And then we take it from like, sort of that umbrella level. And then I send Josh like a mini feel, which is me on voice memo going, you know, playing some chords and a little bit of a melody maybe and nonsense words, send it to Josh, he sends back a beefier version of that, which, Josh, I'm sure you can speak more to it, you receive a -
Zack 12:53
So you receive bed bones. And the doctor goes to work.
Gabe Gibbs 12:58
Yeah, well, Doctor goes to work.
Josh Colyer 13:00
So I just, I try and just figure out the chords really quick of what he's doing. And then I think of think of like an idea of, it's, it's really important in music production, always nail how you want a song to feel. So if that always has to be in the back of your mind, like, kkay, this goal, this song has to accomplish this goal for making you feel this certain way. And so I would take what he would do, and always keep that idea in my mind. And so I would just throw in ideas that I thought serve the, the feeling of the song. And so I would sometimes pick purposefully bad sounds because this needs to sound like a bad version of some old 80s opera, or whatever it is, and I would just go down that path as hard as I can. And we would just send it back and forth to each other until we had like an actual song that was achieved the goal of feeling a certain way. So
Gabe Gibbs 13:56
But yeah our goal was basically like, let's have Josh produce the best possible track that we can produce I mean, of course don't want to make it like perfectly good. We still want to have like bad patches and like things that make it sound clunky but have Josh produced the best possible song and then just tank it with the lyrics like start with like bet it's, our formulas bad bones, good Josh, bad lyrics again, and then you arrive with this sort of middle ground of like a listenable song, right, like terrible lyrics.
Zack 14:33
And so how long is an episode? I mean, to get it from bad bones to that?
Josh Colyer 14:38
It's hard to say exactly how long it takes because we wrote these six episodes in like three or four weeks.
Zack 14:47
This is like a season. This is season one of -
Josh Colyer 14:49
The season of writing. Yeah, we wrote it all, we had to set deadlines for ourselves. So we had to do it within three or four weeks. So we wrote, we probably spent I don't know what, is that like four days, four days per episode?
Gabe Gibbs 15:04
Yeah, at the tail end it got really quick. I think our first episode before we like figured out kind of the structure that we want, we kind of toyed around with Oprah's day off for a while until we settled on a structure that we liked. And then after that we were kind of running out of time, because we already had flights booked for New York.
Zack 15:27
Oh to record with people, because you guys are in Detroit?
Josh Colyer 15:29
Correct. Yeah, yeah. So we had working demos of all the songs before we went, and we and we had to send those to them 10 days out so that they can learn them.
Zack 15:39
And are you giving notes to them? Are you directing them in any way? Are you saying, hey, whatever you want to do.
Gabe Gibbs 15:45
So it was a little bit of me half directing and kind of also trying to do the stuff and then deferring to Josh to make sure he got what he needed. So for the most part, we kind of ,we kind of let him, we kind of let them rock. Yeah. Unless they were like, “Oh”, I'm like really good friends with gray Henson, so I don't mind telling him what to do. But, but everyone else is like his, like, buddies who I have like done gigs with, or I've hung out with, for the most part, we tried to be notes-free, unless there was something that like, we couldn't understand or whatever.
Zack 16:21
But when you approach these buddies, and you're presenting them with, “hey, I want you to sing about griptape on a skateboard”. Like, how, how is that? Like, is there any fear of like, are they gonna be able to? Or are they gonna be down with this? Like, do they get it generally? Do your guests kind of get it? Or do you have to sort of like - this is a fun thing we're doing just go.
Gabe Gibbs 16:46
Yeah, I would say, Josh, you felt like everybody, I felt like everybody got it because we sent the demos and everybody understood and we also, you know, in the in the texts and phone calls and emails that we sent, you know, there's like in big bold like, “this is supposed to be bad” like this. Letting you know, you know, this is a bad idea, that’s the point.
Zack 17:12
So bad it’s good. Let's listen to a little Gray Henson and Olly Olly oxen-free singing about that grip tape on a skateboard.
Cut to Excerpt:
17:22
I can feel my momentum is only slowing
‘Cause you are the wheels to my trucks
Without you I'm not sure I can keep going
Don't worry, my friend
The task is set for me to destroy that LLC
Don't worry my friend
I'll do whatever it takes
My skater heart breaks for you
BACK TO INTERVIEW
Zack 18:14
I'm standing in my kitchen. I'm doing my dishes. And I'm like, What? What? Why am I feeling things right now? What is happening?
Josh Colyer 18:22
Yeah, the most emotional decisions for chords.
Zack 18:27
Okay, so this is how, you're revealing to me your secret now. You said that this is this is a moment where you're like, Okay, how's the audience supposed to feel? This is Josh manipulating me with a series of chords, a song, a ballad you may have heard a million times before, but it works. And so, it’s formulaic a bit, but it works. Right?
Josh Colyer 18:42
If you were to mute the vocal this could work and like a beautiful moment at the end of like a love story. Yeah, by the sell of the vocal, it's just yeah, you're right, singing about LLCs and skateboards and yeah
Zack 19:00
You’re just using science and knowledge to manipulate my human body because of years of musical knowledge, man. I feel I'm a part in your game Josh Colyer. And I like it. And I like it. That's Olly Olly oxen free. That is Episode Two I believe it is?
Josh Colyer 19:21
Yeah it is. That was fun. That was super fun.
Zack 19:22
Well, I'm watching you guys have so much fun listening to it now and it but it sounds like so much effort to make and I guess I'm just curious about like, when is this process rewarding for you? When is it fun?
Josh Colyer 19:36
It's fun. It's like the different levels and stages of fun throughout. It's for me, I love doing what I do so that I could hear the final thing to really like just sit down and listen to what we've done. So, this is super fun for me because I haven't heard these since the aired. And so it's kind of bringing me back to writing and then finishing, finessing and recording and mixing all the all that so this is probably the most fun I've had, probably outside of recording it with Gray himself, but this is super fun to go back and listen to.
Gabe Gibbs 20:11
Totally agree. The recording was, it was fun. Yeah, if we didn't have so, we recorded all six episodes in three days, which was nuts. So, it was basically like recording every episodes, like three to five songs. So, it was like, record an EP in the morning and then record an EP in the afternoon basically. Yeah, yeah. So it was chaos, but it was like, yeah, I would say that's where the fun for sure came. But I agree Josh, I was realizing that we were both jamming because I haven't heard this in like a month or two.
Zack 20:44
And you can sit back and you just get to sit back and enjoy it now.
Josh Colyer 20:49
Put it on Spotify and let it let it fill your house.
Zack 20:53
Do listeners have listeners dubbed themselves anything yet? It's a sort of a big sign of podcast. That's when you've achieved some sort of podcast notoriety when listeners give themselves a nickname. Are there, for your listeners that you've heard? From friends or family? And can I workshop some
Gabe Gibbs 21:09
Dang, no! Yes, Zack.
Zack 21:13
Well I’ve just been, I've been referring to them as m&ms - musicals that never made it. These are m&ms and m&m-ers. We might like receive a little backlash from from “big candy”, but I think we're fine. I think it's fine.
Gabe Gibbs 21:26
We're not worried about, I'm not worried about, bring it on big candy! Yeah, bring it!
Zack 21:32
And that's true you wrote a musical about defying corporations. You know how to handle this, but so I found some real life m&m-ers, some real life Musicals that Never Made It, and trivia is a bit of a we do we do a regular trivia segment on the show and I thought I'd ask you guys some questions about some real life m&m-ers to see how well you do but you're not playing from nothing here. They're high stakes on this trivia game here on the podspotter. You'll see some pod swag behind me on the beautiful bookshelf. Should you answer these trivia questions correctly, Musicals that Never Made It will live here in perpetuity. They'll go up on the wall forever, all of time we will advertise your podcast forever. So I'm going to ask you three questions about real life m&ms. The musicals, not the candy. And we'll see how well you do. Are you ready?
Josh Colyer 22:28
Yes, very ready.
Gabe Gibbs 22:29
Can't wait.
Zack 22:30
Okay, here we go, no googling. This musical, which contained irreverent treatment of Christian themes, extensive profanity and surreal images such as a trope of a tap dancing Klu Klux Klan, ran for 609 Productions, and won four Laurence Olivier Awards, including Best New Musical name that M&M.
Reverend Christian themes, lots of profanity, tap dancing, Klu Klux Klan members. Ran for 609 Productions flip the West End.
Gabe Gibbs 23:03
Oh, man, I want to say spam a lot. But I don't think it's Spamalot because that did do well.
Zack 23:10
Yeah, that made it.
Gabe Gibbs 23:12
Hmm, Ku Klux Klan. Reverend Christian. There's a there's a musical about - I'm drawing a blank - there's a musical about a Christian boy band. I'm not kidding. It's called. That actually did well. What is it called? There's like there's like three. I don't know what it is. Josh, you know what it is?
Zack 23:31
No Googling, keep those hands up, Josh!
Josh Colyer 23:37
Sorry. You know, what's funny about musicals, I don't know anything about this one.
Gabe Gibbs 23:44
We pass, we pass on that one.
Zack 23:47
That one, that is Jerry Springer, the opera.
Gabe Gibbs 23:51
Oh my gosh, I've seen it. I've seen it. They did it. They did it off Broadway a couple years ago at some place in New York. It's insane. Act one of that show is actually amazing. Act Two is it gets a little whatever. But Act One of that show is actually really good.
Zack 24:08
Oh, wow. Who plays Jerry?
Gabe Gibbs 24:12
I don’t know who played him in this. It was an actor I didn't know but he was very good. Yeah, he was right on.
Zack 24:19
Sounds fantastic. Was there any fighting in the audience? No scuffles ensued?
Gabe Gibbs 24:24
There's like plants they set it all up, it’s very immersive theater.
Zack 24:33
Well you got that one wrong, unfortunately, but you can still win a place for your pod swag. If you answer these two questions correctly. This is gonna be a sound cue. This song is a showstopper from a very famous m&m. It was to be the sequel to a musical that very much made it, the original very much made it, this is the sequel, have a listen and name that m&m.
Cut to Excerpt:
25:00
Then one night your baby coughs, cah-cah
But you go on
You both go on
All those brilliant doctors laugh it off
But you go on, yes you go on
BACK TO INTERVIEW
Zack 25:29
This is a hard one I'm asking hard questions.
Gabe Gibbs 25:31
Zack, I thought I had an idea before you did that.
Zack 25:34
You should go with it. Go with your guy.
Gabe Gibbs 25:36
I know it's wrong
Zack 25:39
It’s the sequel to a very, very popular musical.
Gabe Gibbs 25:43
See that’s what, that's why I thought I was right. I thought you're gonna play something from love never dies which was the sequel to The Phantom of the Opera, which also was a musical that only half made it.
Zack 25:53
Did that ever hit Broadway that that musical that never made it?
Gabe Gibbs 25:57
I don't know if it ever did, it definitely did the West End and it definitely toured. But I don't know if it made it but it was like, it was fine. It was just like somebody quick write this one. The other one made so much money.
Zack 26:10
Yeah, well, that seems to be what happened with the production of this song which is from Annie II, the musical. $7 million spent on the sophisticated sequel which focused on the revenge of Miss Hannigan. No orphans, almost no orphans in it. And Annie has like fifteen minutes of stage time. It's all Miss Hannigan just running around being crazy.
Gabe Gibbs 26:32
Wait that is - I'm gonna do some, a lot more research. That is amazing.
Zack 26:36
You have to do a deep dive into it. There’s some amazing YouTube videos in production. Yeah, Annie II. Don't worry, there's only one question left but there might be some time for questions later to redeem yourself and get cool pod glory up on the bookshelf. I have one more question for you.
Gabe Gibbs 26:45
Aw man, I’m just aching for pod glory, Zack.
Zack 26:36
It’s there for you, just keep grasping. Last question that doesn't really matter. We'll just ask it just for fun. After opening to mixed reviews, this musical was really close to being a musical that never made it. But when it's cast recording of the original production entered billboard cast Album Charts Top 10 in July of 2017, when an off-Broadway run was granted and later 177 performances on Broadway - name that musical. Public sentiment lifted this musical in 2017 from obscurity to Broadway glory
Gabe Gibbs 27:29
I think I know. Is it “Be More Chill”?
Zack 27:31
It is very much is “Be More Chilll”. Yeah, lovely redemption.
Gabe Gibbs 27:35
All right, Thank God.
Zack 27:37
One out of three. But don't worry, there may be time for questions later. It's so funny. Josh, there's no musical in your background that you draw from like, did you do musicals? No, you just like, I don't get them. I don't understand them.
Josh Colyer 27:53
I never watched them growing up. I was never into performing musicals. So, I just don't know much about him. So it's just like, you know, something would come up. And I don't know, I'm just, I'm just music producer.
Zack 28:12
But the songs of your podcasts are all like. It's just it's just good collaboration, huh?
Josh Colyer 28:18
Yeah, he's just making sure that I'm on the right musical track. And then I'll just fill in the gaps with my music knowledge. And then we'll call that a day. The only musicals I know, are the ones that my wife loves that she has me watch with her. Just like the classics.
Zack 28:36
Yeah. So um, were there any early forms of this podcast before it became this where you were working together and you're collaborating about like, we want to make something we want to do something, or was it always this, did it always exist is this you know? We just created this podcast and it had gone through so many different ideas and stages. I'm just curious if that happened with yours.
Gabe Gibbs 28:58
Our initial idea was, like, gonna be a long, single narrative series. That was five to 10. Five to 10 episodes was our original idea. It just ended up we couldn't land on a tone that everybody was happy with. And then I don't know what fully sparked this idea. Josh, do you remember? All I know is we somehow arrived at like, little one offs and felt like that was easier to deal with.
Josh Colyer 29:31
I think we're just going back and forth with the idea and I think it's just what you said feeling like we haven't settled on it yet. And I think you called me one day and just said, what if we just wrote bad, just bad musicals, and just released them as just single bad musicals. And that would be the idea that - and so I just think it just came from your brain. And then you called me and then we kind of went from there.
Zack 29:55
Gabe, you seem to have a penchant for just creating things and starting things and getting people motivated to do things. Just reading about you, you are constantly trying to do something. Has thaat always been a constant in your life? And where does that fuel or fire come from?
Gabe Gibbs 30:11
Ah, that's funny. If you would have asked me that two or three years ago, I would have said, oh, interesting. I think the me taking my drive to make stuff more seriously is just within the last few years, I think I have always felt like more of an actor up until a couple years ago, where my manager a couple years ago, I wrote some songs for a thing just for a friend. And she was like, you wrote those? I was like, yeah. She's like, you should actually take that seriously. Like, don't make that just be a cute thing you do? Or it could actually be a thing that you actually do. So I don't know how to answer that question. Other than I think, yes, it's always been in me, but it's only recently become a thing where I'm like, let's, I've got an idea. Let's make things let's do something. Let's get the people together. Yeah, I think maybe because I'm an extrovert. And I just like, being around people. It was one of the things that like this, this podcast, was very fun in the difference in amount of time, it takes from idea to putting it out versus other mediums. It's just like, it allows you to sort of build that muscle of like, I have an idea. Let's get people together. And let's finish it and put it out as opposed to like, you know, like film development, TV development, or Broadway show development is an insane thing.
Zack 31:38
I’m talking to a lot of people lately, who are just that are really into the idea of making their own sandbox supply. And basically, it seems to be this is this is the perfect format for just like, I want to do it by my rules and make my thing and yeah, do it my way. And so yeah, you totally definitely clear that you have the freedom to just go and be artists. But yeah, like Josh with two kids and one on the way, how did you find the time? I just don't understand, this isn’t your 9-5.
Josh Colyer 32:05
Yeah, this is, this was just a side job, just super fun. So I was able to do what I could in the evenings here at my house, I work at a studio. So whenever I had free time, I could just switch from doing one thing to doing something else. So my job is very flexible with what I can do, what I can choose to work on during the day. So that was super beneficial. Outside of that, that probably would have really slowed down the process of getting these things done. Just doing stuff in the evenings at my kitchen table. And that really became the norm as soon as Coronavirus lockdown hit, I had, I realized we had to finish the season and I no longer had a studio to work out of. So I had to like take care of my family. And then once they went to bed, then I would set everything up at my kitchen table and like work through the night and finish episodes and then get up the next day and you know, family again, and so it was very much just the fight to make time for it even when there really wasn't much time for it.
Zack 33:09
Well, let's hear when a song that you produce that may have explored some similar themes. Juggles the work versus relaxation conundrum you probably find yourself and this is a song from Oprah's Day Off”.
Cut to Excerpt:
33:29
Who am I if I step off the gas?
Have I shattered all ceilings of glass?
This whole free time things making me gag.
Name one thing that could be harder than resting.
It’s R&R for billionaires.
A taste I haven’t tasted
R&R for billionaires.
It might just be time that’s waste.
BACK TO INTERVIEW
Zack 34:01
That’s R&R for millionaires. Sorry, billionaires. Get it where you get your podcasts. That's from episode Oprah's day off episode. Any memories from listening to that tune?
Gabe Gibbs 34:10
That was the first song we wrote for this series was R&R for billionaires, which over a year ago now.
Josh Colyer 34:17
Yeah that’s so funny.
Zack 34:21
It's interesting that that dilemma, as content creators or artists or whatever, you kind of are always thinking about that, like you are your self employer. And so that dilemma between like, do I want to be great, or do I want to hang out with my wife? Like, that is a really hard sort of constant struggle. It must have been nice just to have an excuse to have to sit at your kitchen table and be creative every night for you, Josh.
Josh Colyer 34:48
It got really - I was just fighting through falling asleep at my computer a lot of times, because I just like my two year old wasn't sleeping and so I wasn't sleeping, and so it was it was cool to be able to do something. But I was just exhausted man when I was finishing up the season, it was so much fun. But yeah, it was it was a bit of a bit of a struggle or a bit of an issue to figure out how to do it.
Gabe Gibbs 35:12
If it's not already clear, I just wanted a platform to sing and talk. And yeah, Josh just does all the actual episode, I just like to hear myself talk.
Josh Colyer 35:26
Not entirely, because you wrote all the scripts, you wrote all the dialogue, you kind of did a lot of the work ahead, like front, all the pre production, all the writing of the dialogue and stuff. So you did all that upfront.
Zack 35:38
That’s good collaboration.
Gabe Gibbs 35:41
That's true.
Josh Colyer 35:42
That's a lot of thinking through and a lot of creative stuff up front.
Zack 35:46
But let's take a quick break here. We'll be right back.
MUSIC TO COMMERCIAL BREAK
ZACK: We are here to fill the role of looking for great content for you we are we are podcast liaisons, if you will. And if you like this show, please check us out and subscribe and visit the pod spotter.com and on Facebook and Twitter and Instagram and all the other places you put pictures of your kids, we're going to be there on IG we are @thepodspotter and check us out there for lots of good stuff. And please leave a review if you can a good one a bad one doesn't matter. All press is good press and subscribe and rate and review us on Apple podcasts and help spread the word if you don't mind. We are going to release a new episode every Monday, every Monday we're gonna have a new interview and we're going to feature a new wonderful little pod that we think you should be listening to. And we're just gonna start plowing ahead so please keep listening and if you have any suggestions of quality pods that we haven't highlighted that you think we ought to give a listen to, please recommend those and visit us at thepodspotter.com so we know about them. Thanks, everybody.
BACK TO SHOW
Zack 36:10
I remember hearing on a podcast, I don't know which podcast it was, and maybe I didn't even hear it at all. I listened to so many podcasts like you sometimes regurgitate pod facts, which is like distorted ideas from different voices. And one pod fact I remember is that like, good collaboration isn't made. You don't find it in New York and LA, like you make it back home. It's like those people that you grew up with. Those are the people that like that cocktail is what makes you know, something great, you know? And so it's like, you don't, don't hang out in LA, like, move back home, find your people and then come back when you have something to make. And it's clear that your collaboration is a product of that.
Gabe Gibbs 37:24
Yeah, that's so interesting, because Josh and I, because I'm in LA now, but I'm in Detroit, because my family's still there. You know, semi often. But there's kind of the unteachable, like same home base of just like, being the same age and growing up in the same area we have, whether we realize it or not, we have the same influences. So when we're talking about things like we have so many similar touchstones, you know, to me, that's so interesting to hear. This is the first time I'm hearing that as like a collaboration idea. That's so interesting, because Josh and I, we have we immediately have a shorthand, you know, like minute one of working together just because, you know, you grew up in the Detroit area, and everybody knows, if you're our age, we all know who Jr. Jr. is. We all know, you know what I mean? Like, there's all these guys that were 5-10-15 years ahead of us doing stuff, guys and gals, and so we just have the same touchstones. That's very interesting.
Zack 38:25
It's all you want as a parent is like, you just want your kids to grow up and find that person. Find people that like-minded that they enjoy and like can be creative with and stupid with and be themselves around.
Josh Colyer 38:36
From that Southeast Michigan, Detroit, Michigan has a lot of a lot of artistic people, creative people coming out of it. It's really bizarre, like, for some reason, in the nation there's a little pocket in Southeast Michigan where a ton of people have come out of like, the Oakland County, Detroit world like Jr, Jr. A lot of famous producers are from here, I guess, might be coming from Motown history, classic music being a part of the city, but I feel super grateful to be a part of a community that has been so artisticly focused. It's just really it's just really funny because you wouldn't think that all of my people that I look up to came from like the same little area.
Zack 39:19
I can tell you from an outsider, it is very I'm very jealous of the Detroit vibe. It feels like a cult. It feels like a private club hanging out with people from Detroit. Like I was I have been working with Mr. Keegan Michael key he's from Detroit. If you met someone that was from Detroit, instantly chemistry instant like they do a handshake and a thing say secret words to each other. I'm like what is happening right now? Describe the cult of Detroit. I guess you just did technically. It’s just a like-minded culture of artistic sensibility.
Josh Colyer 39:51
Yeah, there's the focus on arts, but also like the work ethic to make it happen. I think all happens out of Detroit.
Gabe Gibbs 40:01
That's interesting, Josh, I like that. Yeah. That it's like that sort of blue collar sort of trait work ethic. As I'm sitting here wearing a Motown shirt.
Zack 40:15
See, represent, it’s a private club. Josh, you'd like to just sit and talk and let people hear you and you've created this sort of false bravado narcissistic character that enjoys himself. Oh, sorry, Gabe. And you've created this character that does like to hear himself. And I have one more round of trivia redemption for you. Okay, but I wasn't able to match the level of bravado that you brought to your character, so I enlisted some outside Broadway help whose going to come in and ask you this next batch of question. This is a segment I like to do called “how well do you know your baby” and ask you three questions based on your own podcast to see how well you even listen to the thing or even know the thing that you made. And you're gonna hear a familiar voice helping me with these questions. Are you ready for how well do you know your baby? Yes, let's hear it.
Cut to Sound:
41:13
Hello Mr. Gibbs and Colyer. It is I, contemporary colleague and friendly rival PJ In the new hit loop de loop my lady, Edwin Prescott, man of a 1,000 dreams describes his passion, thusly finish the lyric. “I am at my desk late at night, anglin lines with my protractor, but to be the very best.”
Josh Colyer 41:38
I got this. A Loop de Loop is what I'm after.
Zack 41:54
Let’s here if you are correct…”a loop de loop is what I’m after”.
Gabe Gibbs 42:02
Wait, so Josh hasn’t met PJ, but PJ and I did Book of Mormon tour together. You guys know PJ?
Zack 42:07
Yeah, I know PJ, PJ is a good friend, PJ knows everybody. Nothing, nothing but good things to say about you. So we got him for these questions. You answered the first one correctly. Let's hear question number two PJ if you wouldn't mind.
Cut to Sound:
42:11
In Iron Chef, the musical. The powerful Iron Chef cat Cora is described as entering the scene with these three qualities making it “hard for anyone not to be intimidated”. Here they are. Grace. poise, and
Gabe Gibbs 42:32
I know, do you know it, Josh.
Josh Colyer 42:34
No, it's you.
Gabe Gibbs 42:36
I think the line is straight up wealth. Grace, poise, and straight up wealth is that the line?
42:46
Oh no. scrape up wealth. Yes. Straight up. Well, a fantastic moment of literary genius.
42:48
Zack 42:07
Let’s hear how well Gabe knows your pod.
Cut to Sound:
42:11
Straight up wealth. A fantastic moment of literary genius.
Zack 42:55
PJ was so game man. He was so game. He listened and was a fan of the pod.
Gabe Gibbs 43:02
Sweet PJ.
Zack 43:04
Guys you got two correct. You're getting your pod up here no matter what here after this. So congratulations on two out of three. Let's hear and see if you can get a clean sweep. And, you know, if you get the clean sweep you go on your top shelf pod. So, you are still playing for something here? PJ take it away for question number three
Cut to Sound:
43:24
And now for the final question, which I'm sure will not be a problem for you, gentlemen. In the breathtaking coming of age musical Driver's Ed, our protagonists are stumped by this trivia question. You of course, having fully embodied every character you've ever written should have no problem remembering that if coming to a full stop at 60 miles per hour takes about 60 feet of distance. How much distance would a car travel when stopping from 80 miles per hour? Well?
Gabe Gibbs 43:56
Oh, no. Oh, no. Okay, so it's cause the joke is that it's 60 to 60 on the first one, but then it increases exponentially the second time, but it was 80 to oh, shoot. Oh, no. Gabe is standing up. I'm pacing. Oh, no. Oh, no. Okay, I want to say I want to say this is not my final answer. Josh. Does 100 sound right or no?
Zack 44:27
If coming to full stop at 60 miles an hour takes about 60 feet of distance. How much distance would a car travel?
Josh Colyer 44:35
Oh is this when the student answers or like the class answers?
Gabe Gibbs 44:40
Yeah, they get it wrong. It's right at the top of the episode.
Josh Colyer 44:44
So we're saying what they say or what the actual answer is?
Zack 44:46
Yeah, this is good. Gabe help Josh because he can access the file from his weird music brain.
Gabe Gibbs 44:50
Yeah, yeah.
Josh Colyer 44:52
I know what the students say.
Gabe Gibbs 44:53
Yeah, they say 80 feet, but then it's 100. Right? Is the correct answer? Yeah, let's go with that.
Zack 45:05
Let's go with 100. Listen to PJ.
45:08
Cut to Sound:
It would take almost 160 feet. I'm sure you guessed that correct. Congratulations boys, til next time.
Gabe Gibbs 45:15
No we didn’t PJ! Sweet PJ.
Zack 45:22
Thank you PJ. Sweet PJ sweet, sweet PJ. So guys, two or three still gets your swag featured on our bookshelf. This is sort of beautiful. What happened here they sent us a mug from pod swag. We ordered a musicals that never made it pod, this is going to be a visual joke for you listeners. And there is the the label is the same color as the mug you can’t actually see what the thing is, so we're gonna proudly display this musical that almost never made it until you add hot water to it. And it's a temperature thing, apparently. And then you get to see the label. Look at that that was a musical that almost never made it. But given the right concoction, given the right chemistry. This got to see the light of day. So happy accident there that'll be displayed forever. No one will ever know that. It's your podcast, of course. I'm never gonna put water on. But we will proudly feature. Thank you guys, you ask your guests on your pod if they'd like to share any advice to aspiring artists to varying degrees as they answer the question. But I'm curious if you have anything that you would like to share to composers or aspiring actors that are thinking about getting into this, what have you learned, you know, from your years of experience, and maybe just from to make it a better question, what have you learned from just producing, you know, maybe this pod.
Josh Colyer 46:51
Like anything else, anything else artistic, sometimes you just have to spend a lot of time on it and have a lot of patience with it before you nail down the right vibe for something. My friend that I look up to a lot here once told me just to continue doing it for fun, just record your friends and finish their projects for fun. And then then that will, you know, that will only help you as you do projects in the future. So it's really just about working all the time on stuff that you want to work on and finishing it. And then kind of working through the hard moments, even if it's not exactly right, at least you finished it and you work through it. I think that's super important to kind of literally just push through it. If you're if you're tired, like I was at midnight, we have to push through it.
Zack 47:40
That’s super good. Follow that spark that little thing that gets you excited, it makes you want to wake up like whatever that is, pull that thread. That’s good.
Gabe Gibbs 47:48
Similarly, my wife and I actually talk a lot about sort of the the rhythms of creation and the rhythms of art in general and kind of how Josh and I sort of identified, we're not the first people to do this, but pointed out sort of tent poles, structural moments and musicals and kind of built on those like, the reason I knew how those were supposed to feel was just because I had done them so many times and the rhythms have that existed in me, I don't mean necessarily musical rhythms, but like, just the patterns and the things like that, I think just kind of doing it. My cousin was who's a writer and a novelist and in Minnesota posted a thing about art being like taking out the trash, just like something that you have to do every single day. And in order to maintain like a clean and healthy brain and a clean and healthy creative process. Often we feel like it's one big push, but the more successful endeavors are more like taking out the trash every day. Like I'm working on a screenplay right now. And it's just about like, just writing something bad every day just getting like five bad pages, like taking out the trash every day. And then you kind of go back and pour over it. And that's been something that's been on my brain. It's just like just taking out the trash. That's all you got to do today. It's just that.
Josh Colyer 49:18
Yeah, you're exactly right. It takes it takes the ideas in your in your head to never leave, you need to always be thinking about something, at least for me. And that's what I found to be true with working through something anything artistic, I just literally just think about it a lot. Even if I'm not recording something or writing something down. I'm always thinking about okay, how do I get a better drum sound. I'm like my wife asked me what I'm thinking about. I'm literally thinking about mic-ing a drum set and how I can get something to sound better.
Zack 49:51
Unplugged time, dormancy is not always off the clock is what your saying. It’s a great note, because I feel it a lot with this. I spend a lot of time just thinking about you know, you guys and interviewing and talking to you, it's not time off the clock. So that's a really good note to anybody looking to get into this that like, just thinking and meditation is not necessarily don't look at it as enact.
Gabe Gibbs 50:14
Yeah, your brain, your brain chewing on it without you doing any physical tangible work is a huge part of the process just your brain chewing on it. Totally, Zack. I think that's right on.
Zack 50:25
Guys, I know better than to ask you to tell us what's coming up for you. You just don't ask actors that are artists or creatives that, it's just not nice. But if there is anything that you wanted to plug or anything else that you wanted to talk to our pod people about, feel free to do that. And I won't put any expectations on a season two because these are weird times. But I do hope there is another season of musicals that never made it.
Josh Colyer 50:47
Thanks, man. Yeah, us too.
Gabe Gibbs 50:50
Yeah, we'd love to do another one right now of course, given that ours involves a room full of people to record it's a little tough.
Zack 51:00
I just read that Walmart is converting parking lots for drive-in movie theaters. And I'm wondering if there's and if Broadway musicals have come up with anything to other than Disney plus airing?
Gabe Gibbs 51:14
Airing Hamilton, yeah.
Zack 51:15
Are you talking to your people? Is there anything that like Broadway is figuring out where we can get you know, some of this content people that that crave it? Maybe Best Buy parking lots? Maybe Applebee’s parking lot? Nobody’s going to Applebee's right now. Guys, let us use your parking lots.
Gabe Gibbs 51:35
Heck, yeah.
Zack 51:36
Well, you're specifically positioned to only benefit from this because fans of musicals. There are six, fully produced beautiful little musical nuggets out there waiting for you on all platforms, wherever you get your podcasts. You're on Stitcher, you're on iTunes, is that right? And maybe some others that I don't even know about?
Gabe Gibbs 51:53
Yes, yeah. All of the available streaming.
Zack 51:56
All the available pods, check out Musicals that Never Made it with Gibson Collier. Guys, it is the last five minutes of my podcast and I have a running theory that no one listens to the last five minutes of podcasts by now they're done cooking, or they're done with their jog. And so I kind of just use this time to just recite poetry or tell a secret or tell off a former boss and I thought today I’d apologize to Jamie Pereira in the fourth grade. Jamie, wherever you are. I had a huge crush on Jamie Pereira. I got sat catty corner to her, big crush. And at the end of the first day, I farted. And I remember trying actively trying I thought as a fourth grader, if I sniff if I inhale that if I sniff really hard, it won't get her she won't smell it. And so I was just like, trying to inhale my own fart and I didn't I think I got it. I was a kid, you just think you can eliminate those particles by inhaling right back in so I need to apologize.
Gabe Gibbs 53:06
Zack, the thing about that is there are a finite amount of fart particles.
Zack 53:10
I think what we're learning about right now that air particle you know, particle travel, and you can contaminate the air with them. So, so I wasn't so dumb, right?
Gabe Gibbs 53:19
But that's what I'm saying is like there are a finite amount. So if you could sniff them all up. I mean, I don't know if you're humanly able to but
Zack 53:28
I wasn't just going, I was going mouth from what I remember. I was trying to consume – the horror that emanated just, just like terrified, terrified that she would know. We weren’t friends after that. What we know about air from Fauci these days, is that. God had we all just been wearing face masks and fourth grade I wouldn't have been so traumatized by that experience.
Gabe Gibbs 53:57
You’d have been fine. Was there noise too.
Zack 54:00
I think the noise was coveedr. I think it was that bad that it was silent. Yeah, I just remember it being horrible.
Josh Colyer 54:07
At least hear it coming from you necessarily.
Zack 54:10
Yeah, no, she couldn't localize it. She couldn't but I thought that's good. You know when something like that, at that age, you just you cramp up, you know, you get sweat starts coming. So she probably identified that I was sweaty. So something's wrong with us might be definitely. Guys if you feel like sharing anything. Now would be the time because after all, no one is listening.
Gabe Gibbs 54:42
Okay, well, then I'll confess that I had headgear in elementary school. I haad headgear. Did you know that Josh?
Josh Colyer 54:53
No how long did you have that for?
Gabe Gibbs 54:54
I had headgear for enough time that it felt like when I was in fifth grade it felt like eternity. It’s exactly what you're thinking. It was the big sort of bow and arrow-esque piece of metal, for the listeners I'm taking my my fingers and drawing a you around my, just as you would imagine that attached into like a retainer, I think it was because my front teeth were big and too far forward. It was a full on or orthodontia nightmare. And it was my I lived in such fear of having people to find out about that. So it is liberating here on this podcast to say out loud, fifth grade class of Hamlin elementary school. I had headgear.
Zack 55:51
So the headgear did not make the trip on sleepovers.
Gabe Gibbs 55:55
No way, are you kidding? You just go like I'm gonna set myself back a day and it’s worth it.
Zack 56:02
Was there any pushback from the folks where they like - gotta take your head gear. They got it?
Gabe Gibbs 56:10
I think they got it. They were like dude, this is - that’s tough.
Zack 56:15
That’s rough. I can’t believe that was ever the standard. Can you believe it? Like, considering now it's just like, popping in a little piece of plastic. Like that's really? The fact that kids put these giant hunks of metal and then, okay, sleep tight, honey.
Gabe Gibbs 56:29
Yeah, it was like, it was like attached with like, a little, like, sort of yamaka of seatbelt material. And then like, grabbed the outside. Dude. It was like that little girl in Finding Nemo who taps the glass of the thing how she's got that big right thing? It was exactly it's not great.
Zack 56:51
We got headgear we got particles, Josh, anything?
Josh Colyer 56:54
Yeah. Well, let me just take this time. This might take 20-30 minutes.
Zack 56:59
Do it, no one is listening, it’s fine.
Josh Colyer 57:01
Let me take this time and just vocalize my disappointment in the construction of children's bicycles. I have a six and a two year old. My six year old this summer -
Zack 57:19
Prime bike age.
Josh Colyer 57:20
Yeah, we got him a bicycle. With training wheels. Super, super pumped to give it to him, I spent time putting it together. And this was probably a week and a half ago. And not a day goes by where I don't fix it. I full on have to fix the bike. Like nuts. Nuts and Bolts aren't the correct size. I had to make it to Lowe's before they closed for the night so that the hardware guy could help me find the right bolt and nut for the training. I had to put my own parts my own thinking and money into fixing it. Every hour something happens. So this is my time just to proclaim my disappointment in the manufacturing. So today, or yesterday he was riding it, and the training wheels are made of metal and they're starting to bend because he’s putting too much pressure on the left or right and so I have to like push it in so that it like becomes even again enough for him to ride it. And I'm telling you I think they’re just gonna send it back and -
Zack 58:32
It feels like a perfect opportunity to let your son listen to oly oly oxen free, get him into skateboarding. Forget the bike.
Josh Colyer 58:39
I got you a skateboard kid.
Zack 58:45
Here you go kid. Well, thank you, gentlemen. Discussed in manufacturing particles and headgear. But no one heard it because no one is here anymore. Yeah, the podcast that you're not listening to is Musicals that Never Made It, put it in your library. It's darn good stuff. Guys, I hope to see some more. Listen to some more. And thank you for sharing your gifts with us. I appreciate it.
Gabe Gibbs 59:08
Thank you, Zack. Thank you.
Josh Colyer 59:12
Yeah, thanks for having us.
MUSICAL ENDING
Zack 59:26
This has been The Pod Spotter where we showcase the pods that you absolutely need to know about but if you have one that you think that we should know about please let us know via thepodspotter.com or Facebook or Twitter or Instagram or just yell really loudly and I'll hear you. Thank you.
Zack 1:00:17
This has been Zack Robidas. The Pod Spotter is created by the Price Brothers, produced by Oink Ink Radio, associate producer Tori Adams, and is recorded and produced at Baker Sound in Philadelphia.